VIVAnews - Legal system is a significant legacy the the Netherlands contributed to Indonesia. Dutch Minister of Justice Ernst Hirsch Ballin's visit to Indonesia may inspire the nation to reform its legal system.
Ballin is an expert in law as well as a politician. He was once a Minister of Justice during the Prime Minister Ruud Lubbers administration. After leaving his office, Ballin was once again appointed the same office as of September 2006 under Prime Minister Jan Balkenende administration.
In his recent visit to Indonesia, Ballin dropped by the Supreme Court, the Constitutional Court, Corruption Eradication Commission and Indonesian Police. Ballin happened to meet Indonesian Minister of Justice and Human Rights Andi Mattalata. "Indonesia's legal sector changes quite significantly," he said.
How does the former colonizer of Indonesia views the current Indonesian legal system? VIVAnews journalist Renne Kawilarang and Karaniya Dharmasaputra interviewed Ballin at the JW Marriott Hotel, Jakarta, on Wednesday, Feb 25.
Indonesia is inherited by Dutch legal system. Penal Code is one of legacy. Many experts considered the code has been outdated inasmuch as it can no longer specifies such cases as corruption, money laundering and Human Rights violations. Therefore, calls for law reform, including Penal Code revision, have been set forth recently. In accordance with your visit to Jakarta, how does the Netherlands support the hope?
I understand that the Indonesian Penal Code can no longer adapt the current situation. However, I have been observing Indonesia in the past few years and have carried out several significant attempts on law reform. I today (Wednesday, Feb. 25) paid Supreme Court's training center a visit. It was an important experience. I could witness Indonesia's willingness in law reform upon seeing the training for the Supreme Court.
I realized that the legal system in the country has advanced. And we must take notice of the fact that the legal system must be more improved.
How does the Netherlands respond over the performance of the court in Indonesia in response to the handling of Human Rights activist Munir's case?
Certainly. I cannot interfere with the court's acquittal verdict regarding the case. However, I'd like to say that the solving of the case is an example of direct partnership between the Netherlands and Indonesia. It is possible that, by virtue of a help from Dutch officers, a suspected criminal is brought before the Indonesian court, and vice versa.
Therefore, it's a pleasure for me that Indonesia is ready to ratify the UN Convention on Organized Trans-National Crimes. That is one of the reasons of why I visit the country and meet the government officials, including Minister Mattalata. It is in line with a partnership on legislative modernization and law education as well as its implementation. We can provide attorneys with information from our country, and vice versa.
When you met Minister of Justice and Human Rights Andi Mattalata, both of you signed a memorandum of understanding on the establishment of a joint commission. Our Penal Code still legalizes death sentence while the Netherlands and the European Union applies no more. Will the commission discuss about the issue, for instance, by removing death sentence from the Penal Code?
The commission is not concerned with policy issuance sector. It only focuses on training partnership. It functions as an information provider for each party and prepares partnership in other sector. I am really glad that the commission membership includes high-ranking officials and legal experts of both countries.
As a result, the commission may add new projects concerning legal partnership of both countries. We have pioneered similar partnership in 1983 when I was directly involved in a preparation of legislation draft in Indonesia.
We have maintained partnership in education sector, skill exchange and will pioneer partnership on prison management as well as migration management. However, it doesn't mean that we have a different manner over death sentence.
But I am glad that at least we have already had a partnership commission and we cooperated in an operational level.
When will the joint commission work?
The commission will soon be readied. Those who will join in the commission have started to work and decide which sector that that they will work on. We all have considered the historical aspects which dealt with unpleasant moments that we had never expected before. However, we will also talk about the history of both nations which benefit both parties.
The Indonesian Attorney General has intended to arrest the fugitive of the Bank BNI case, Maria Pauline Lumowa, in the Netherlands due to banking crime valuing to US$192 billion. However, the detainment will be very difficult taking into account Lumowa is a Dutch citizen. How do you respond over the request?
Well, the request of the extradition has been submitted to my department. We will certainly weigh on the issue cautiously because we deeply comprehend of the serious crime that the suspect had committed.
However, the suspect is a Dutch citizen and we cannot extradite Dutch citizens unless there is an agreement allowing that the sentence can be dealt with or carried out in any country where she lives.
We do not have yet such an agreement with Indonesia. Probably we will have such an agreement in the future if the situation alters. If not, then I can consider the chance that the charge will be taken over by Dutch prosecutors. We deeply understand the importance of the case for my colleagues and attorney offices in Indonesia.
So, will Dutch legal enforcers handle the case?
We have a will in cooperating in the investigation of the case. This is one of the significant subjects in our partnership, that is, to help each others in investigating a crime.
With regard to prisoners transfer between the two countries, the issue had been brought forth by Dutch Foreign Affairs Minister when visiting Jakarta in January 2009. How about it?
Indeed Minister Verhagen said prisoners transfer partnership from one country to another is important. The issue was also raised during my visit to the country. We are certainly expecting for more progress on the partnership with Indonesia.
Translated by: Bonardo Maulana Wahono
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